To Sunday's Northwest Herald article about the sheriff's race and issue, a comment was posted by "rokuvortex" on October 11, 2010 8:45 p.m.
"I happen to want to see the sheriff's dept. get nationally accredited. That tells me as a citizen and taxpayer that the department is professional and meeting professional standards because it is verified by an outside independent panel - not just because the sheriff is telling us they are professional. This proves it. So let Mahon stay in Crook county. And this Philpot, if you had to volunteer and furnish your own equipment, that was no police department. It sounds like mickey mouse police, get real that's no experience."
"rokuvortex" shows his ignorance very clearly. Perhaps he'll come over here and embarrass himself further.
He clearly does not understand the use and value of volunteer deputy sheriffs in western U.S. sheriff's departments. The department in Colorado, where I was a sworn reserve deputy, had about 40 trained volunteers. We had full-time commissions and concealed weapons permits. All provided their own uniforms and weapons. Those who were interested in the Mounted patrol furnished their own horses, tack and trailers. Others equipped four-wheel-drive vehicles with authorized emergency equipment. And still others owned and maintained police-equipped motorcycles.
We performed all the duties of the full-time deputies, with the exception of cashing a paycheck every month. If we had horses or vehicles, we paid all the expenses of using them. And we didn't complain about it. We knew what "To Protect and Serve" really meant.
I was authorized for solo patrol duty and drove a county squad car, providing exactly the same services as hired, paid deputies. When I went to court, I went on my own time.
CALEA accreditation will not mean that the McHenry County Sheriff's Department is any more or less "professional" than it is right now. It will mean more manuals on shelves, unread and unheeded. It will mean more meaningless paperwork and employees hire to "count" incidents, reports, errors. It doesn't mean that problems will be fixed, only reported in a standard method.
The "rules" will be in place, but they should have already been in place. They aren't being followed, if they are in place. If they were being followed, there would be written reports from Deputy Woods, Sgt. Ellis and Lt. Miller about how Miller got shot at the range. The "investigation" was a joke and purely CYA.
A sergeant would not be allowed to falsify a crash report, and the sheriff would not refuse to pay a woman $5,300 for the damage a deputy caused to the woman's car by careless driving.
SWAT team members would not surround a home with guns drawn, looking for an employed woman who owed less than $300 in unpaid court costs. A phone call or a letter would have gotten her re-started on payments.
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19 comments:
Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac met professional standards, too.
The department's professionalism is verified by an outside independent panel - the voters and tax payers.
As many school districts and other units of government have discovered, whether it's federal or state funds, the costs to comply with guidelines ends up costing more to administer than what was gained by participating.
So too, with many sorts of accredation programs across the public spectrum.
You're right Gus -
Have been reading up on CALEA. It's all about SELF-assessment, organizational charts and maintaining reams and reams of paper.
It appears that review and accredation by CALEA all takes place in the office and file room. CALEA is not about determining the quality of department and it's officers in the field, it's wholely about administration.
It's like getting an ISO certification for your business. Those of you in manufacturing know that when you're being audited for ISO, you rarely if ever see the official out on the shop floor, in warehousing or shipping, or anywhere else. They're going through paper.
Just because your administrative system recognizes standards on paper and maintains that paper does not ensure that the actual process itself if being practiced "out on the floor".
If the paper reporting from "out on the floor" is itself false or non-existent, then that accredation means nothing. You've already proven this to be so, Gus, many times over.
But gosh darn it, we got them purty file cabinets chock full of paper! Plus, the best part is all them meetings and conventions! Whoo EEEE!
DBTR, you are exactly right. A company can manufacture a piece of crap and, as long as they follow their standards to do, they won't lose their ISO certification.
In 1995 I worked for a company in Richmond, Va. that asked me to help it with ISO certification. I explained to the president what the estimated cost would be, including fees for an ISO consultant, and he refused to pay it. I declined the "opportunity".
One of the things that bothers me about Nygren was training standards. I was surprised that Nygren denied bailifs, jail guards and process servers, among others, the the ability to conceal-carry their firearms off duty.
Nygren is likely correct that State Law on this is clear, that he cannot issue those permits unless these folks have first completed police officer firearm training courses.
So here's my point: Why haven't they been trained?
Those I've mentioned, due to their employment in the justice system, are certainly targets after-hours due to their employment, and should be able to protect themselves accordingly.
Further, they can't be trusted with a gun in public otherwise, yet they ARE trusted with a gun while on duty while surrounded by the public?
Nygren talks the talk on concealed carry, but refuses to walk the walk. The least that should be done is to get these folks police officer firearm training. If this training is crucial for firearm safety for these individuals and the general public, why has this not been done?
I'd rather our law enforcement comminity packs heat, rather than file folders and organizational charts.
Nygren said he supports "the concept" of concealed carry. He was careful not to say that he supported it!
Even though I "don't have a dog in this fight," meaning I can't cast my vote for you in the sheriff's race, since this past Memorial Day, I've read several comments in the Northwest Herald regarding your "sharing an apartment with a sex offender." Initially, during a visit to Woodstock on Memorial Weekend, I stumbled across that allegation, as printed in the comments section of the NWH. Since then, once again the allegation resurfaced within the past several weeks, and was printed again by the NWH. Gus, would you would be willing to address that issue for me and any other interested parties? Personally, I'd really appreciate your willingness to settle that question for any and all readers of the NWH and your blog site. Thanks so very much if you would take a moment to speak about this for interested supporters of your candidacy.
DBTR...Nygren does not deny them the right to carry off duty, the ILLINOIS LAWS prevent that. The issue is not Firearms training but rather being a CERTIFIED Police Officer. Crook County is exempted from many state laws. Read the statutes and they state in counties OTHER THAN COOK.
I beleive Nygren has gone on record as saying if Illinois changes the law which prohibits NON SWORN police personnel to carry he would support it. Currently Corrections and Court Security are trained with firearms and meet the 40 hour State firearms requirement, but are not considered LAW ENFORCEMENT under Illinois law. I personally support the right to carry, but also know the law which prohibits it. There are many PT cops from some of these PODUNK PD that carry 24/7 that I trust far less than the C/O and Court Security.
Right now a Co. concealed carry permit will cost you $100.00 and an eight hour Satuday class. I assume it would have been even easier to get many, many, many, many years ago.
Right now a Co. concealed carry permit will cost you $100.00 and an eight hour Satuday class. I assume it would have been even easier to get many, many, many, many years ago.
lol gus is silent
My concealed carry permit cost $26.00 plus one $0.44 stamp, and it's good in 22 states. Not in Illinois, of course.
Mine cost a little more to include Florida as well as all the others. No class on legal aspects and/or liability issues, huh? Scary. That stamp wouldn't have cost 44 cents way back then.
tired, not sure what you are thinking of in regard to the cost of a stamp back then. I was referring to the valid concealed carry permit issued to me right now.
Your "article" speaks of sworn reserve deputies with full-time commissions and concealed weapons permits in Colorado. You haven't lived in CO for some time. The cost of postage then was less than now. Heck, even I can follow the lines. My point is that having a concealed weapons permit is easy to get and therefore not any kind of qualification at all-especially in a state that it doesn't apply.
tired, my Colorado CWP was issued in the 1970s and was surrendered when I resigned as a reserve deputy in 1981. It was not obtained by mail.
The concealed weapons permit that I hold now was issued when a first-class stamp was selling for $0.44. Still confused?
I'm not sure you are correct about "easy" to get and not any qualification. I submitted my FOID card with my application. As you probably know, FOID cards are not issued to everyone.
I am correct about how easy it is to get a CCW. For the one that includes Colorado a FOID is not even required. Actually, legally, everyone can get a FOID unless they fall under the very specific restrictions. Illinois has many toddlers with FOID cards-and probably as many dead people as vote in Chicago or get Social Security checks.
tired, so that other readers are not confused, what non-resident CCW application does not required an Illinois FOID card? Utah? Florida? Both of those states have stringest requirements and qualifications.
And Illinois? To get a FOID card, the application must meet requirements and avoid exclusions. I doubt that any toddlers have FOID cards, unless their parents lied about their date of birth.
And no dead people have valid FOID cards. How could a dead person present his FOID card?
Deflect and swerve... You've got to work at the McHenry County Sheriff's Dept.
Requirements for Utah and Florida CCW permits do have a list of requirements. None of those is an IL FOID card. Check the ISP website there is no age limit to obtain a FOID. Dead people do not have to present a FOID card but they may have them. Dead people do not have to show a voter reg. card to vote and plenty of them still get Social Security checks as well. MCSD? Not even close.
Although there is no minimum age for an Illinois FOID card, the following is from the Illinois State Police website:
"a person who is under 21 years of age must have the written consent of his or her parent or legal guardian to possess and acquire firearms and firearm ammunition." And that parent or legal guardian must b e eligible to possess a valid FOID card.
It's interesting that the guardian or parent need not actually possess a FOID card to sign for his under-21 child; he need only be "eligible" to possess the card.
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