Five diners at Culver's in Madison were challenged by Madison police last Saturday, while they were seated trying to enjoy a meal. They were "packing" sidearms, as allowed under Wisconsin state law. Law-abiding citizens are allowed to carry unconcealed weapons; they must be visible and not covered by an article of clothing.
An observant woman (in this case, a worry-wart) had called the police, and they (the police) began gathering outside the restaurant. Maybe someone should explain to her that armed robbers usually don't sit down in a restaurant and enjoy a meal before robbing the joint.
According to one news article, "These individuals were not given any choice; they were simply told they have to provide their ID or they'll be cited for refusal to do it -- for obstruction."
The trouble started when two of the five refused to provide identification, explaining that they were not causing any problem and shouldn't need to identify themselves. I'd have done the same thing!
"If you're a law-abiding citizen, certainly the law in this state is that you can have open carry," said DeSpain. "It's your Second Amendment right and we respect that. But we still need to find out what people are doing when they walk around with guns on their hips because people do get concerned."
Joel DeSpain is a spokesman for the Madison (Wisc.) Police Department.
My position? It is Wisconsin state law that you can carry unconcealed. The cops could have stopped to talk to them, learned that the bearers were familiar with the law, and left them alone. They had no reason to suspect any crime was about to be committed, just because some worry-wart called them.
I shall be contacting Culver's headquarters tomorrow. It's one of my favorite places to eat, both locally and when I travel. However, if they change their policy and deny law-abiding Wisconsin resident to right to follow state law in their restaurants, I'll be choosing some other place to eat.
The police in Madison need to understand the state law!
An observant woman (in this case, a worry-wart) had called the police, and they (the police) began gathering outside the restaurant. Maybe someone should explain to her that armed robbers usually don't sit down in a restaurant and enjoy a meal before robbing the joint.
According to one news article, "These individuals were not given any choice; they were simply told they have to provide their ID or they'll be cited for refusal to do it -- for obstruction."
The trouble started when two of the five refused to provide identification, explaining that they were not causing any problem and shouldn't need to identify themselves. I'd have done the same thing!
"If you're a law-abiding citizen, certainly the law in this state is that you can have open carry," said DeSpain. "It's your Second Amendment right and we respect that. But we still need to find out what people are doing when they walk around with guns on their hips because people do get concerned."
Joel DeSpain is a spokesman for the Madison (Wisc.) Police Department.
My position? It is Wisconsin state law that you can carry unconcealed. The cops could have stopped to talk to them, learned that the bearers were familiar with the law, and left them alone. They had no reason to suspect any crime was about to be committed, just because some worry-wart called them.
I shall be contacting Culver's headquarters tomorrow. It's one of my favorite places to eat, both locally and when I travel. However, if they change their policy and deny law-abiding Wisconsin resident to right to follow state law in their restaurants, I'll be choosing some other place to eat.
The police in Madison need to understand the state law!
6 comments:
Missed the part where it said it was Culvers policy to call the police.
I don't think Culver's had anything to do with this. The woman who called -- was she a customer? An employee? What?
The folks it sounds like you have your complaint against are the Madison Police, for asking to see ID in the first place.
Culver's did not call the police. A woman in the vicinity did.
However, it seems that Culver's might be reviewing its policy of serving customers who are armed. Apparently, a Wisconsin business can post No Guns Allowed signs and bar the door to those who are packing heat.
Guess that means that, as in Illinois, only criminals will enter the place armed.
Whitmore2, right you are. I don't know if the woman who called the police was a customer or passerby. Probably, a customer. And not wrong to call, but the action of the police officers was wrong.
Because state law allows open carry, police should expect to see people carrying. Perhaps the refusal of two of the armed customers was due to how they were approached by the police.
If the police were polite as they asked for ID, probably all five would have handed it over. If the police were bullies, then they ran into resistance. Only time will tell.
Yes, good job Gus. Take it out on Culvers who really had no part in this besides "thats where it happened." You really are not in touch with life...
Frank, one media report was that Culver's was re-considering its position about allowing armed customers on the premises to dine. Currently, they allow it. They could restrict the property and post against armed customers.
THAT is the point I'm making.
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