Regarding comments posted to the "Read the Pavlins' Complaint" article posted on July 23, one reader today posted this comment which read, in part: "I read through each of the reports written by the deputies and honestly, they don't seem concocted to me. FOIA any incident that generated a multiple unit response where more than one deputy did paper and you'll see the same types of consistency as in the Pavlin reports. Report writing is structured very specifically using the same key phrases and written with the same types of details for a reason...court. Not conspiracy."
Cops learn in Report Writing 101 to use certain phrases. That's true. Using those phrases leads to consistency and ease in understanding. It simplifies the officer's job, too, because many officers today are only high school graduates, and you know what kind of skills in English and English Composition so many high school graduates leave with.
Some initial observations about the reports obtained by the Northwest Herald and placed so quickly on its website:
Dep. Lambert's report fails to note that Mr. Pavlin was taken to the floor. From his report you would understand that Mr. Pavlin was handcuffed while standing on his feet. There is no explanation given for taking his to the hospital, instead of directly to jail. Let's see; maybe bloody wrists could have something to do with it?
Dep. Mandernack wrote "Upon making contact with the residence, I observed broken glass at the entrance of the door."
Yes, that could happen. If you made contact with a glass panel in a door and it broke, then you could observe broken glass... Remember what I said about writing skills? Say what you mean; mean what you say.
Further on Dep. Mandernack wrote, "I then brought Jerome to the floor, utilizing a arm bar take down, in better attempts to control him and to defeat his resistance. Dep. Vogel then assisted in handcuffing Jerome."
Now, keep in mind that Mr. Pavlin was 80 years old and weighed 130 pounds. Next time you are having a beer with your friendly deputy, ask him to tell you about an arm bar take down. Better yet, ask him to take you down. Better check your hospital insurance first.
Dep. Vogel wrote, "Dep. Mandernack then assisted Jerome to the ground, and I held Jerome's left arm..."
Assisted Jerome to the ground? Is "assist" a word from Report Writing 101 that is used in place of a word to describe using force to accomplish something?
Dep. Bruketta failed to explain in his report what he observed about the method that Dep. Mandernack used to place Jerome under arrest.
This is why departments separate officers and do not put them in the same room with a "conductor to lead the symphony."
Subscribe to:
Post Comments (Atom)
16 comments:
The holes in your posting just shows your lack of knowledge about actual police work. You are speaking as a civilian talking about subject that he/she has had no training and it shows.
DA, as the old guys in the Bartles & Jaymes ads used to say, "Thank you for your support."
If I'm not mistaken, according to the police report, Mr. Pavlin didn't realize himself that his wrists were bleeding and I don't think I need to go into detail about elderly skin issues, however he is by far, not a young man. The glass...an observation I would have included, as well. Arm bar takedown is to prevent some attorney from endless questioning about, "Well, did you TACKLE Mr. Pavlin with a ten yard head start?" and so on and so forth. Let's not make a mountain out of a molehill with "assist", as again, this is a commonplace term that indicates he did not go to the floor on his own. Nothing more.
And the failure to explain what Bruketta observed and Lambert's failure to note that Pavlin was taken to the floor, indicates to me that these were NOT concocted reports. If they were, every report would read as if they all had the same eyes. Too much very specific detail. Every officer on scene did not have his attention focused on exactly the same thing at exactly the same time. Different perspectives, and different observations. One "night of terror" for the poor, poor Pavlins. /rolls eyes.
So will you offer a blog apology to the SO if you find that the Pavlins may have been less than honest with you about the events that transpired on the evening in question?
When I'm wrong, I 'fess up. I don't think I'll need to hold my breath on this one. I had no feeling that they were exaggerating.
Maybe I should add here that this is not the first set of MCSD reports that I have read that appeared orchestrated.
So you really don't know for sure that these reports were all written together, your just guessing and spreading the word, to make these good deputies look bad. Where did this rumor start? And I fully agress with DA when he said "The holes in your posting just shows your lack of knowledge about actual police work". If you were trained the same way these deputies were you would know why their reports look the way they do.
The question isn't about training. It's about supervision, leadership, guidance, oversight, observation, management. And, yes, I do have strong reason to believe that the deputies were in the same room, writing their reports at the same time.
I don't think any one of them could have said, "Nahh, I think I'll sit over there or out here and write my report, and then I'll just turn it in."
But, you know? There is a good way to find out. Put them under oath, out of one another's hearing, and ask them.
Deputies are entitled to good training, good supervision and strong leadership. Most want to do well, to like their jobs (tough as they be at times) and to have the respect of their superiors and their peers.
Supervisory comments like "We Own the Night" (have you seen the movie?) are not to be tolerated.
Multiple reports written for one incident will probably seem orchestrated to most civilian eyes. I can see why people with no experience in law enforcement would read the reports posted on the NWH and believe that they it was a collaborative effort. But keep this in mind, too. For some officers, report writing is a weak area. I don't know who signs off on the reports generally, if it is a sergeant or commander at the SO. If four out of five deputies mention in their reports that Mr. Pavlin was handcuffed, the sergeant may pull aside that fifth deputy and ask why it wasn't in his report. If he didn't witness it, it is not included. It would seem suspect to me if that fifth deputy wrote, "I did not witness Mr. Pavlin being handcuffed".
Lastly, just because they may have been in the same room writing reports does not mean they rewrote history about what happened at the Pavlins. I think if that were the case, those reports would be well-written, with much more obvious embellishment. When people lie, they tend to overindulge with detail, no? Classic "Investigations 101", Gus.
And I haven't seen the movie.
Gus said...
The question isn't about training.
**********
Yes it is a question of training. You are questioning the integrity of these officers and questioning the tactics they used, their report writing techniques, as well as items put in and or left out of said reports. You are doing this questioning without any real knowledge besides what you watched on Chips and Barney Miller! If you had any training to back up your allegations, you would know that a report is a summary of events, not a complete account of everything that happened down to the last little detail verbatim. "I arrived on scene at 2200 hrs. The outside temperature was 71 degrees Fahrenheit with a 4 MPH wind from the SW. I noticed a squirrel run up the tree to the left of my squad..."
You say that the reports may have been written at the same time in the same room. So what? Does that automatically equal that reports were written any differently than if they were each flown to different states and told to fill out their reports? You make accusations against their integrity based solely on your OPINION. Even if they did discuss the incident, so what? Do you think that the Pavlins did not discuss what happened? Should they have been separated from each other , held incommunicado until they had completed any and all statements? The fact that, according to you, not every report has every detail the same would tend to discount your theory of collusion.
"I had no feeling that they were exaggerating." Well dang! as long as you had no feeling they were exaggerating, then why even have a trial? Gus has proclaimed!
Your hatred of the police must be growing stronger every day. Come on Gus, when do you plan on asking to be put on the police and fire commission? Then they will HAVE to pay attention to you! Anybody else think that is what Gus is angling for?
While you are having that beer with that deputy, ask them how they would place a person who does not want to be put into restraints in restraints without using any type of force. Vulcan Mind meld?
Dang! What color were the squirrel's eyes?
I was wondering if it was a black or a gray squirrel. If it was black, you can be damned sure it would be a case of profiling.
Well written, DA.
Hahaha, you make me laugh little man. In your world you are never wrong so you would have no need to 'fess up!
Come on, ace. Give me a break.
I was wrong once. That was the time that I thought I had made a mistake, but I was wrong.
Gus I guess youre right...all the deputies got together, said "Hey, lets beat the crap out of an 80 year old, get sued, lose our jobs, not be able to finacially support our familys, not be able to get hired anywhere else". You're not too bright are ya!
In case you didn't know, the arm bar is the least forceful takedown taught. Also, as funny as it sounds the elderly and small females are the worst to control because they crazy flailing about and you really don't want to strike them because of their size so you simply place them on the ground
QWA, I guess the grand jury saw more things wrong with the Pavlin incident than you did. That is why the charges were dropped.Lets see what a federal jury thinks of their civil case.
Gene, I don't "see" anything about the Pavlin incident. I read the reports, I've read what has been written on here and I've read the Pavlin's complaint. There could have been a number of reasons I have no knowledge of (neither do you) as to why the charges were dropped, however that in itself doesn't mean that the Pavlins are telling the truth or that the deputies did anything wrong.
And I concur...let's see what happens. :)
Your hatred of the police must be growing stronger every day. Come on Gus, when do you plan on asking to be put on the police and fire commission? Then they will HAVE to pay attention to you! Anybody else think that is what Gus is angling for?
*****************
Look at that! Ol' Gus is running for Sheriff! He will make them listen to his babbling yet! How long after he is sworn in (like that will really happen! LOL) will it be before he is making his first traffic stop? 3 minutes? 5 minutes? "Respect my authority!"
Post a Comment